Issues with Dish's DTVPal DTV converters?
Several blog posts have indicated there might be some firmware or software issues with Dish's DTVPal DTV converter causing them to malfunction. We contacted the company to see if they were aware of any problems. The company confirmed that a "small minority of boxes" have such issues, and that starting Friday, Aug. 29, affected consumers can call the toll-free number listed in the manual (1-888-638-9912) to exchange their box for a new one. You'll need to have your receipt handy, and you'll get a new box within 90 days. You'll have to pay for shipping the box back, but there's no additional shipping charges to receive the new one.
Some readers who are not Dish satellite TV subscribers have also indicated they've had difficulty receiving customer service, as they are prompted for their subscriber account number. Dish says that it is training its customer-service reps to handle issues regardless of whether a DTVPal owner is a Dish subscriber.
We also asked whether the $40 Dish TR-40 CSA DTV converter, which started shipping this month, might have some of the same issues. Dish tells us that TR-40 boxes have updated software, so there shouldn't be any issues. We hope to test one the TR-40 shortly, but as far as we know, it is functionally identical to the DTVPal.
If you will be exchanging your DTVPal for a new one, let us know how your experience goes.
—James K. Willcox
Posted by: everett whitney | Apr 23, 2009 6:42:54 PM
P.S. for {cc hof } - -
Lousy typing ! --- sorry -- here IS today's web special @ $199.99 . . . . . . . . . . .
https://www3.tivo.com/store/boxes.do?type=renewed
everett
Posted by: everett whitney | Apr 23, 2009 6:34:38 PM
TO: cc hof - " .. Horror Stories ...?"
Certainly there are FAR better equipment on the market, No Question!
Not coupon-eligible, however!
www.tivo.com has several for O.T.A/-digital use, complete w/ Program Guide, dual tuners for recording (1) channel while simultaneously-watching a different channel, etc..
They also have "Web Specials" at reduced pricing which changes daily.
Copsts usually star at about !79 on up to as much as a person wants to pay, with added features and / or storage capacity on each version.
Also, a mandatory $13 / monthly fee to partially cover their payments for the Copyrights which permit "recording!"
The federal coupon boxes are the absolute cheapest quality possible - - - lowest bid available! As one comment from C.R. has said ..." only a temporary solution, so these do not need to be long lasting !"
Posted by: cc hof | Apr 23, 2009 12:21:17 AM
These horror stories terrify me! Is anyone aware of any other converter boxes that have the timer function? I'm hoping in the meantime some other more reputable company may have developed one
Posted by: J. G. | Mar 30, 2009 4:21:07 PM
I purchased two DTVPal converter boxes in August 2008. I made the mistake of not connecting them at that time, but did not want to go through the hassle since my VCRs and DVD recorder were working great. When I connected the first box, the guide and the unit's clock read one hour off. Nothing that I could do would correct the condition. I emailed DTV Tech and didn't receive any help. A few days later, I connected the second box and the time was off by seven minutes. Once again, I emailed DTV Tech. Since I purchased the units locally at retail, DTV Tech couldn't find me in their database. I was given a link, but was informed that I would have to call their customer support. Since I had purchased the units greater than 90 days ago, there was nothing they could or would do. Although the warranty technically was no longer in effect, I would expect a "reputable" company to honor obvious defects. I cannot in good conscience recommend this product.
Posted by: Dan | Mar 16, 2009 7:45:58 AM
I'm back after leaving my initial comments, and to be honest, a bit shocked that I see so few positive comments about this unit. It would appear that Dish Network has been relying on the disconnectedness of it's various DTV Pal users as a protection against the failure of it's unit. In the internet age, that is rather hard to do.
Again, I would say that the audio, reception, picture and general concept of the unit is great. I agree with a previous user that when using an externl recording device one needs to be aware that the audio volume of the DTV Pal needs to be high to record. This is a simple item to overlook and the DTV Pal is not to blame. I have my unit hooked up to an ATI "All in Wonder" input (coax+RCA inputs) to record programming. When the many ram related functions in the unit actually work, the quality is to love, what can I say. It is a dream come true.
It continues to astound me, the predictable unreliability of any of the programmed functions in this unit. And it's not as if I don't have other units to compare it with. In fact, I have the ideal situation for a side-by-side comparision. My Digital Stream DTV box is literally hooked up to the same AC line, same antenna, and therefore it has access to the same quality of signal reception. The only difference is that it is hooked up to a different monitor so that it and my DTV Pal can be recording or monitoring different channels (or the same if I so desire) at the same time. (The Digital Stream unit has no timer recording functions.)
Since so much of the interface to programming on the DTV Pal appears to be the same as one might encounter with their satellite service, it is possible to arrive at the conclusion that some of the same hardware as is utilized for that service has been put to double-duty to create this device. Because of the apparent failure of this device to perform reliably, it also suggests that what might have seemed like an obvious solution to a design problem (and what could have been a great manner in which to introduce the uninitiated to the Dish Network system) has failed miserably.
The experience of one user here, (in which after four months they had not received replacements for their 2 defective DTV Pal boxes) suggests that either Dish Network has not solved this problem, or that the failure is on such a high level that they might bankrupt themselves simply by attempting to replace all the defective boxes which have already been shipped.
If that is so, than I think it might be interesting to see who at Dish Network Tech might be receiving their walking papers this year. Of course, this is all... conjecture.
Dish Network's response and handling of this situation leaves them vulnerable to a great deal of criticism and speculation. I think that if they ever intended to get anything good out of getting involved in the distribution of their own brand of DTV converter boxes that they had better stand up soon and stand behind their product by replacing these defective boxes, return postage and all. They turned to boon-doggle what started out to be a great design for a box. And to another user, I refuse to accept this new-age policy that hardware should now be treated like software and that buggy, or in old terms, defective design is now not reason enough for replacement. Dish Network's mismanagement of this problem has turned into the suggestion of a great class action suit. I am hoping that will not be the final story written regarding this device.
Posted by: Karen | Mar 10, 2009 7:08:00 AM
I bought one DTV Pal, hooked it up and it scanned the channels and nada. Took it back. Hooked up second one. Same deal. Put it in the closet until Feb. 17 even though my local stations were already broadcasting in digital.
Hooked it up on Feb. 18 and it found the channels.
I also have a DISH satellite receiver and there are major problems with using the remote for the DTV Pal.
The DTV Pal remote turns the TV off when it powers up the DTV Pal. If I turn the TV on, then the DTV Pal turns off. It also turns the satellite receiver off.
The off/on button on the remote for the DISH receiver now turns the TV on and off not the receiver. This is a new problem since hooking up the DTV Pal.
It's like HAL in the movie 2001. The two units and remotes are conspiring against me.
The only solution I've found is to stand in front of the TV, unplug the DTV Pal several times and turn the TV and satellite receiver on manually. At some point, it works. It can take up to ten minutes.
It would have helped to have put an on/off button on the DTV Pal.
My ultimate solution is to wait for my coupon and buy another converter box and donate the DTV Pal to someone who can't afford a box or couldn't get a coupon.
I really hate to do that to someone but I guess it's better than nothing in the rural market I live in.
Posted by: Dan | Mar 10, 2009 4:37:16 AM
Some of the qulities of the DTV Pal are excellant. I cannot say the same for the scheduling facilities, the EPG updating, anything related to that area of it's functions. The are indications that either the software is completely buggy, or that there is a bad ram chip installed, or that perhaps the power supplied to this portion of the device is unstable.
The unit frequently will set itself to the wrong time and you cannot correct this. Suddenly it will be 7 minutes fast.... or 7 minutes slow. it changed it's time by an hour on one of my units prior to daylight savings time. What was weird was that this only took place on one of my boxes.
One day I may schedule several programs and it will function correctly (assuming you can get it to set it's clock to the right time) The next day, you may wonder why it didn't start. You look at your schedule and find that some or missing, or that the channels which you programmed into the unit for each event have been changed to something which is incorrect.
The service department is rotten. They keep on talking about sending me a firmware update over the airwaves. Having worked in broadcasting, I find myself wondering if these people have access to the EPG programming service and actually have the capability of doing this. Or perhaps many of their service people, no matter how many times you try to explain what is happening to them in English, still can't understand that you are not receiving your programming from a satellite.
I have played along again and again with these people. It would appear that they have no way to resolve these problems and do not want to admit this. In fact, today when I actually talked to a representative that did not appear to be based in India I couldn't help but pick up on this feeling that he was sceptical that one of my boxes might be functioning better than the other one. Although I don't think that he wanted to admit it verbally, I am starting to suspect that he believes that there are some functions on these boxes which are not reliable at all.
I finally got him to send me a replacement box... and then he started this extremely long and fast spiel which was impossible to follow where about the only thing I seemed to be able to catch was how Dish Tv Network had intentions of charging my credit card. Again. For my replacement box for a unit which never worked properly?
I spent the extra money to get these automation functions. It would appear that there is a possibility that I may never be able to use them, and that Dish Network may have intentions to screw me once more by charging me for another box. But that part... remains to be seen.
This has been a really frustrating situation. There are so many features which I genuinely like about the DTV Pal. The program guide navigation is miles above any other box which I have used. The reception seems to be very good. Setup is very easy, the remote control is really nice. It is the elements which have to do with automation and EPG data processing that seem to be the achilles heel of this device, and in regards to service, whether intentional (to hold off on a avalanche of expensive return orders) or accidental, the support for th unit seems to stink.
Posted by: Steve B | Feb 19, 2009 3:05:07 AM
"2. Why should owners have to pay shipping to get an exchange on a defective product?"
For the same reason a you would have to pay for your own gas/tolls etc. to drive a defective item back to the store.
Posted by: Ray McCullie | Feb 14, 2009 5:09:07 PM
I've been having the same issues with my DTVPal DVR box.
Having been around computers from an early age, I never expected it to work perfectly. The auto timer is the only real option for people that want to record TV shows, don't be fooled, a "converter" box is really just a digital cable box for broadcast TV. I already had a new DTV ready recorder but I like my old one, A Panasonic with a HDD and it's worked fine for years after disabling the built-in TV guide, so the DTVPal was a needed upgrade.
A few suggestions for those less able to wait or willing to return their products. In the setup menus there are two options which you might want to change;
One is the program guide update, which allows you to set a time for it to download new guide information. I would suggest you disable this feature.
However to me the real problem seems to be the auto shutdown timer. I would turn this off completely so the unit always stays on. True it's a waste of power but when the unit is allowed to try to turn itself off, it attempts to preform maintenance that seems to cause it to stop responding.
As with all things electronic sending it back is not the way to fix problems, waiting for the firmware updates makes more sense. The only question is, when will DISH acknowledge the problem and update the firmware.
Other then that, I would recommend they not ship with UPS because dropping electronics during shipping could also be the cause of damaged memory which could cause faults even in working firmware.
Posted by: everett whitney | Feb 11, 2009 6:39:24 PM
TO: " dish-is-bad ..."
IF you are looking forward to waiting yet another extended interval - simply keep on waiting! And, there IS the strong possibility that the (whenever) replacements will be bad as well!
Just "give up" and buy a new digital set or sign up for the limited channel cable offerings - ours had it for $11.75 / mo..
Much less than a new antenna system, which WAS going to be necessary.
Posted by: dish-is-bad | Feb 11, 2009 1:37:38 PM
I ordered and received 2 dtv pals in September. I had many problems with the customer service, that is another issue. However, I called in October because both of the units were performing erratically and finally was told they would replace them. It is now less than one week from the February transition (yes I know it has been extended, but some of the local stations are still converting over since they are ready) and I still do not have my boxes. It has been 4 months! I have made numerous phone calls to the company and each time they are so surprised and confused until we spend a lot of time on the phone re-investigating the problem. Always ends the same, we will send you your boxes, they are just "on hold" since there are so many orders. Seems they can break the law about honoring their agreements. They have my money and they don't care. Any suggestions?
Posted by: DTVPal Hater | Dec 13, 2008 12:21:38 AM
I bought a TR-40 about 2 months ago (also because of the good reviews I read) and I'm now regretting for making this poor buying decision. Just like everyone else, I'm also experiencing the same problems as described by everyone. I either cannot turn on the box or the box stays on with nothing on the screen and cannot be turned off. The problem actually happened within the first week after I got the box but recycling power would help. However, now it gets to a point where a hard reset of waiting 15 seconds before plugging back in the power would not work at all and the process needs to be retried many times. I contacted Dish tech support via live chat and they asked me to try plugging in the unit to a different power outlet. That's BS. I also asked if I have the latest Firmware (my version is F103) and they told me I have the latest. However, according to this web site (https://rweb.echostar.com/departmental_content/TechPortal/content/tech/receiver/tr40.shtml), the latest is F106. The guy told me F106 won't help when I pointed him to the web site and asked if there is a way to flash the FW. Finally, they offered to replace the unit when I pointed them to this blog because the guy denied ever hearing such a problem. Since I own it for less than 90 days they will replace it free of charge. However, I'm responsible for paying the shipping charge of sending it back. The box costs me ~$9.xx after $40 coupon. I figure if I ship the unit back to Dish, I will need to use a courier service (or USPS) with tracking option so that's going to cost quite a bit of money. It's better off for me to just buy a different box (which I already did by buying a Tivax STB-8 from Meritline.com for $13.xx after tax with free shipping and $40 coupon and this box is top-rated!!). I don't know about the rest of you but I don't see why we have to pay for the shipping charge of sending the unit back for replacement especially if there are enough people experiencing such problem. Also, I feel they're playing delay tactic here and try to get people to try stupid things so they go past the 90 day warranty period. I'm definitely going to file a complaint to BBB. Dish should be banned from selling craps like. I also suspect that TR40 is cheaper than the original DTVPal because it's possible that it's refurbished from the original faulty DTVPal when they got enough returns which they don't want to throw away and found a way to recycle them back to the Market? Finally, I think someone ought to start a class action law suite so innocent consumers like us can be protected.
Posted by: jndkr | Dec 5, 2008 9:40:21 AM
I initially purchased this box because of the positive reviews I'd read and, when I first received it, was impressed. However, since then, my DTVPal began working sporadically and I've come to regret my purchase.
Initial pros... set up was a breeze, the picture is clear, and the detailed tv guide is a great feature.
Initial cons... no unit/base controls (i.e., can’t turn on/off or adjust settings unless you have the remote).
Current cons… the operation of the unit has progressively deteriorated. Started off where the remote wouldn’t work (wasn’t a battery issue), then picture would freeze and unit would have to be unplugged to start again, then unit wouldn’t turn on at all (power light would flicker then fade). And forget about customer service… you’ll have a frustrating experience begin trasnfered from customer service to tech support then back to customer service then disconnected, then being told replacements can only be processed by Tech support who’ll then tell you there’s nothing they can do… you get the picture. :/
Posted by: Diane | Nov 20, 2008 5:24:13 PM
I just hooked up my DTVPal and I'm trying to figure out how to get my VCR to recognize the correct channels for recording, I can't figure out how to find the channel number, says to highlight listings, but can't find any listings.
Posted by: Dave C. | Oct 22, 2008 8:37:29 PM
I purchased two DTV Pal's from an on-line dealer.
Shortly after hooking up the first one I noticed the box would power up on its own at random. Then I couldn't power up the box using the remote (batteries good, etc.). The only way to get the box to respond to the remote is to disconnect the power cord to the box then reapply power. Wa-la remote then controls box again for a week or so then same issue occurs. Make a long story short - same thing happened to the second box.
Called dishnetwork and got the same run around that most people have described. Responses like " you don't have an account so we can't help you" were told to me. Sent various emails and finally
had a customer service person understand my issue (after several emails to her).
She created an account then issued an RMA # for return of the converters.
I will have to pay for shipping though...
What a joke this has been!
And to think I waited for this product to hit the market assuming it was the best based on some initial product reviews at the time.
I don't have dishnetwork, but now receive a blank bill every month due to the fact that an account was created for me (only to send these converters back)..... just adds to the irony of this
whole deal!
Posted by: estefan2020 | Oct 11, 2008 11:50:55 AM
Yes Michael Frederick, a rep from solid signal who handles ebay transactions, replied in e-mail:
"No returns on converter boxes.
Thank You
SOLID SIGNAL"
They have a real nice website, with allot of stuff. Though I think they got bit by the manufacturers return policy themselves, and are washing their hands of it, or possibly there a small business despite their website. witch it may be, they have no store front and an e-mail rma return policy "Email Returns: returns@solidsignal.com (please include your order number for RMA request)" I don’t see businesses with store fronts with an rma policy. Their website has no info on returns other than e-mail for rma number,
Even that here is e-mail addresses from there website that may help.
"Customer Service Manager: mae@solidsignal.com
Customer Satisfaction Manager: audrey@solidsignal.com
Warehouse Manager: allan@solidsignal.com
Marketing Manager: moose@solidsignal.com
Purchasing Manager: pat@solidsignal.com
Controller: shay@solidsignal.com
Operations Manager: matt@solidsignal.com
President: jerry@solidsignal.com"
Though you can do something they are a member of bizrate and shopping.com, links below if you have a complaint make sure you also voice it to them.
https://www.bizrate.com/ratings_guide/cust_reviews__mid--141794.html
http://www4.shopping.com/xMR-Solid%20Signal~MRD-307380~S-1
Posted by: Michael Frederick | Oct 9, 2008 12:56:55 PM
Don't buy DTVPal- ordered two from "Solid Signal" for $132.95- both have failed within 30 days of use- contacted Solid Signal(three times)- no help- said to contact Dishnet - did- they said Retailer is responsible for the first 180 days.
WHAT CRAP!!
Posted by: estefan2020 | Oct 8, 2008 11:05:16 AM
foes this effect the F100 and F101 only? there is someone selling Firmware version 102 and was wondering if this is one that is fixed??? on another forum I herd F106 but cant confirm the latest software / firmware version that corrects the timer / freezing issue. any help would be apprecieated. Thanks!
Posted by: everett whitney | Oct 7, 2008 9:50:40 AM
TO: J.R. - 06 Oct - " 90 Days for repair/replacement?"
It's a wonder that you did get any reply at all ! Other than the fact that essentially all of your units were "bad" originally, you probably wouldn't have gotten any resolution at all. Just "no action" until the limited warranty had passed!
These Converters are the very least "boxes" possible ... none were offered or mfg by the top names of HDTV makers ... just essentially those also making our universe of disposable / throwaway HDTVs.
Consider getting a new local cable or satellite service --- either DO have new, reduced channel, basic services at reduced costs, reported here by C.R..
COX = (24) channels @ $11.75 ... Comcast = (20) @ about $11 ... base satellite @ $20.
Or, simply DO buy a new HDTV & install your own outside antenna for free, O.T.A.-HD now on our 5-6 major networks + PBS. With the horrible world economic crisis, sales are terrific, with many Top Brands available for $700.
Posted by: J R | Oct 6, 2008 3:07:41 PM
I got a DTVpal when they first started shipping in mid July. It worked for about a week, then the picture would freeze while the audio continued before it too stopped. Eventually the unit would power off and on, reboot, rescan channels, and the process would repeat.
I have now been fighting with dish network for two months to get them to honor their warranty and replace my box. My calls have cone as high as the executive resolution team, and they still are not honoring their warranty or their promises.
It wasn't until 5 calls and 5 failed promises that they even asked for the original unit back. I shipped it to them immediately, and the tracking number shows they got it two weeks ago. But they still don't acknowledge that, nor will they give me a tracking number indicating that they have shipped a replacement unit.
And even the service policy in your original article makes no sense. NINETY DAYS to get a replacement from them? What are you supposed to do when broadcasts are digital only and you don't have a working device for NINETY DAYS? Of course given what I've now experienced, maybe it takes such an incompetent company NINETY DAYS to replace a simple device.
Posted by: gregh | Sep 29, 2008 4:06:55 PM
After reading this article I was hopeful that I could finally have the issues with my DTV Pal timers resolved. After spening a hour with Dish Network customer service, all hopes were dashed. It took quite a while for the Dish customer service rep to even understand what at "DTV Pal" was or that it was someting that was manufactured and sold by Dish Network. I read the CR artice word for word to her and waited while she spoke with her supervisor. The answer was that they had no idea what I was talking about and that I must have a problem with my VCR. What a waste of time and money!
Posted by: J Sims | Sep 24, 2008 2:48:22 PM
I contacted Dish Network to obtain exchange information for my two DTVPals with older F101 firmware. After being transferred to tech support, the CSR stated that all firmware versions for the DTVPal are 'current' and there is no reason to upgrade. When I mentioned the CR reporting of "Issues with Dish's DTVPal DTV converters", she denied any knowledge of firmware defects and apologized for CR being wrong about the subject. I asked to be transferred to a supervisor, who admitted that a newer version of firmware does exist which addresses the timer issues. He stated that Dish could not process the DTVPal exchange since I purchased the unit through a third party, and that I should contact the original seller to request an exchange. When I called up CDC, they stated that they could not perform an exchange unless there is a 'hardware defect' or a letter from Dish certifying the current inventory has upgraded FW that fixes the timer issues, which they do not currently have. After I mentioned this to the Dish supervisor, he finally agreed to set up an account for me and perform the exchange through Dish. I paid for the shipping of the original units to them, and they covered the return shipping. The replacement DTVPals (F106 FW)seem to work just fine, as far as I can tell. I wish they had told me not return the original remotes, because the exchange program does not include remotes or cables. I had to call Dish a third time to request new remotes since I had no way to control the new DTVPals. So I repeat, DO NOT send back the original remotes or RF coax cable. They do send new 'wall wart' power adapters, though. This whole exchange process needs to be streamlined, in my opinion.
Posted by: DW | Sep 23, 2008 6:58:27 PM
To cloudsandskye: There is no digital audio output from DTVPal. RF on channel 3 (or 4) is accomplished by the RF modulator on DTVPal is just the same as it is on your VCR. I use composite video + audio (yellow/red/white) quite successfully as input to my old VCR and DVD recorders. I would also suggest that you turn the volume all the way up on the DTVPal. Hiss is usually introduced by having too low an audio signal input level thus introducing a poor signal to noise ratio on the actual recording, ergo hiss. The following is not an advertisement but a suggestion for anyone considering buying new recorders. Magnavox makes a combo DVD recorder with an 80gb hard drive, ATSC and NTSC tuners, digital audio out, and many other very nice features. It does not handle video tape. It is not a HD recorder but has excellent recording quality because it is all digital except that it doesn't have HDMI output. It is very difficult to find this product but WalMart has it online for under $200.00, which is a great bargain. I am hoping that Consumer's Reports will issue an update to its ongoing DTV reviews and include this product.
Posted by: D W | Sep 22, 2008 10:09:56 AM
Can someone please post the firmware version that fixes the "lost events" problem. I have also noticed that my 2 units stall during the downloading of the program guide which seems to cause the clock to lose time (several minutes over several days). I reported this problem to Dish Network but they didn't have a clue. No mention of either problem on their web site. The typical response by manufacturer's; hype the product and ignore the problems.
Posted by: cloudsandskye | Sep 13, 2008 11:12:38 PM
To RCH,
The problem is not with DTVPal, but with my analog VCR; DTVPal is working fine. It is the VCR that is suppressing the volume and adding the hiss because it cannot properly handle the digital signal. That's why I suggest for those who do a lot of VCR recording to skip buying a digital converter box and instead buy a new VCR that has a digital receiver.