Your opinion wanted - GM takes questions to the public

Like any large corporation, General Motors spends a lot of time and money conducting focus groups—talking to its customers and potential customers in focus groups to find out what they want.
This year at the New York auto show, it seemed the company was doing more than usual.

First, at Wednesday morning, GM held a press conference to introduce the Pontiac Solstice Coupe and two new versions of the Australian-built Pontiac G8. As soon as you name any car G8, you signal the world that you're running out of ideas for car names. If that weren't bad enough, the company admitted as much when it announced an Internet contest to name the latest version of the G8, a two-door, car-like pickup truck, very similar in concept to the Chevrolet El Caminos from the 1970s and '80s. Personally, I'm not sure what's wrong with the storied name El Camino, beyond the potential for brand confusion. Or if that has too much (ahem) baggage, why not Caballero, the name of the GMC version of that trucklet, which no one will remember. (GM is working to merge GMC and Pontiac dealers anyway.) Rapper Fifty Cent, who introduced the car, suggested his given first name, Curtis. If you'd like to make a different suggestion, visit GM's "Tame the Name" contest Web site at: www.pontiac.com/namethiscar.

If that weren't enough feel-good feedback, the company invited a group of perhaps 60 enthusiasts of the Chevrolet Volt to a "town hall" meeting in the afternoon and a group of company executives fielded detailed questions about the car. (Read: "Plugged in: Chevrolet Volt.")

The visitors came from those who left comments at an independently operated Web site: gm-volt.com Many were tinkerers who own electric cars—sometimes several, and some that they have built themselves. Many are members of regional electric-vehicle clubs and are well versed in the challenges of building, owning, and driving electric vehicles (if not necessarily in mass production.)

These efforts follow on last years' GM press conference, in which the company asked showgoers to vote with colored balls for which of three microcar concepts they liked best.

All this is to say that GM is either trying very hard to do a better job of listening to its customers, or it has simply completely run out of original ideas of its own. We're not sure which.

To be fair, GM's vice president of global product development, Bob Lutz, has admitted the company underestimated the demand for hybrids. Put another way, before the Toyota Prius came out, GM was completely blind to the market among young, hip urban intellectuals for a car that got good gas mileage and made a social statement that its owner cared about the planet. Now it looks as though the company is aggressively trying to make up for lost time, marked by a slew of hybrid models coming to market and intriguing concept vehicles offering a glimpse at the potential road ahead.

Tell us what you think. Is GM asking the right customers now?

—Eric Evarts

See the 2008 New York auto show coverage.

Comments

[Billy]

I was in the hall and wandered over to hear some of the GM Town Hall, and I am really fascinated by all the successful hype that has been generated by GM for the Volt. This massive concern is a decade and a million miles behind Toyota and Honda in hybrid technology, and has publicly belittled the Prius for nearly as long. Now they are incredibly far behind and yet people believe the Volt will change the world when they haven't even worked out the battery technology yet. You don't have to look far to see their big hybrid push is in huge SUVs with 6-liter engines, and they have the audacity to say in print ads, "Finally a hybrid that makes sense."

As an automotive journalist I've been impressed by how successful the GM marketing push has been, with even CR going overboard on the overall quality of the new CTS and Malibu. There better than the old versions, but still a ways behind the class leaders and the Caddy will probably have reliability issues. I'm also still a bit confused that you guys actually picked the Silverado over the Tundra as best in class by bending the rules. By your own data, the Tundra 2WD is more reliable than any new pickup, gets better milage with a much more powerful engine, and its the only line with standard stability control across the board. It's also a smarter truck, drives better overall and where's the rear camera on the Silverado?

At least you guys have showed a bit of measured skepticism over the Volt, which is good. Hey, I think you guys are the best in the biz when it comes to overall vehicle evaluation, that's why I've been a bit worried lately.

At least (part II) you'd agree that the Hyundai Genesis stunt drivers were a nice touch, yes? They did help sell some excitement.

WTH

[David]

GM is moving in the right direction, at least with the Corvette and Pontiac Solstice/Saturn Sky for styling. The Solstice is available (or will be available) in coupe trim or roadster (really targa) and naturally aspirated engine or turbo charged high-performance trim. I think every sports car manufacturer should offer at least two choices of engine and body styles.

As a current owner of first generation Mazda Miata, I would love to see a coupe version and a "high-powered" -- maybe 250hp range -- version of the Miata. So far, none of that seems to be happening. Don't get me wrong, kudos to Mazda for bring out the Power Retractable Hardtop. (PRHT does not loose any truck space.) My next sports car thought will have a lot more power than my Miata. (I have rented and driven several trims of the current Miata, so I am quite familiar with the car.) That said, coming from a strictly foreign car family, I never imagined in my entire life that I would consider the Corvette. It will be on the short list of my shopping choice.

[RICH M. FISCH]

I WOULD GLADLY PURCHASE A GM CAR. YOUR CARS HAVE COME ALONG WAY. THE ONLY NEGATIVE CONCERN IS RESALE VALUE,OR LACK OF IT. YOU JUST DON'T HAVE IT, LIKE THE HONDA'S. IF YOU STAND BY, YOUR CARS, WITH A HIGHER RESALE VALUE, LIKE THE FOREIGN IMPORTS. I WOULD PURCHASE ONE TODAY. WHEN THIS HAPPENS THE AMERICAN CARS WILL BE BACK!

[manatee]

>As soon as you name any car G8, you signal the world that you're running out of ideas for car names.

Audi has called their cars A3, A4, A6, et. al. for a couple of decades. Those names seem to work fine for them.

Beyond that, I'd like to see GM make cars that are the equal of Toyota's in quality and engineering. Their decades-old strategy of offering "an lesser product at a lesser price" just isn't sustainable. Of course I'd really like to see GM lead -- not copy, but for now I'd be happy just to see them ensure their own survival.

[Cale]

"To be fair, GM's vice president of global product development, Bob Lutz, has admitted the company underestimated the demand for hybrids."

Underestimating seems to becoming something of a habit over at GM. In May of 2006 GM said, through a spokesperson, "... it underestimated demand for high-end and fully loaded versions of its new fullsize SUVs."

They clarified that thought saying, "pent-up demand for higher-trim models of the ’07 Chevrolet Tahoe, GMC Yukon and Cadillac Escalade is making for “much higher volume than what we had anticipated." The answer? GM began ramping up production on its all-new GMT900 family of large utility vehicles.

Turns out GM was right. Sales of large luxury SUVs has continued to be very strong; down only .9% in 2007.

Let's hope GM responds to the underestimated demand for hybrids with the same vigor they put into making full-size SUVs!

[joe]

The GM Pontiac names (G series) are meaningless.

Mazda and Audi have spent years branding their vehicle numbers. Mazda3 Mazda5 Mazda6 and A3, A4 A6 are well recognized. I know I can't afford any Audi numbered above 2 and can afford Mazdas number less than or equal to 5.

Pontiac is going to have to stick to this numerical designations for years time and be sure they're some order and meaning to the numbering.

BTW, I own a Pontiac Vibe.

[Steve Real]

I have a suggestion for the Chevy Volt team. Put a thin film solar cell array on the roof of the car (as an option) an market the thing as the "Solar Series" and tie the whole thing into the battery charging system.

[everett whitney]

It is extremely doubtful that GMC really wants or will listen to anything!

Their track record speaks to this inability - Billions wasted on the original Saturn, a horrible diesel V-8 during our last fuel crisis, this new equally-untimely Hybrid Silverado Truck, a mediocre Hybrid Malibu ( do it properly rather than that pickup at all !), no pro-active elimination of poorly performing Brands ( the Olds elimination list should have included at least 2 more models or names ), insisting upon making models which no one buys until they are forced to shutter brand-new factories !

Their list of failure-to-listen is enormous and all at the expense of the factory workers who can only assembly what has been decreed by these "blind" management gurus!

[Don MacLellan]

Most of my life GM has mimicked other successful cars. Made an imitation Camry, etc.. All they had to due is eliminate the black dots in the Consumer Reports reliability reviews- but nnooo, they thought slick advertising would carry them through; that worked for the most part until cars started pushing into the tens of thousands- GM should have tripped that line, but if it ever did it ignored (denied)the fall. GM always said that they were giving people what they wanted. It never realized that many of their customers had little more imagination than they did- followers of the brand. When the customer's pocket became more educated it sought reliability and value. GMs problem is overpaid under talented management together with stockbroker syndrome. They make money when the company does not.

[Bill Burt]

In 1955, I was a 14 year old boy who sent GM a letter asking for an overdrive in their cars to get better fuel milage. The reply was not something GM could be very proud of. It was a condescending, arrogant letter from an exec who basically told me to not worry about things like that....that GM knew what it was doing and all I should not worry my "sonny boy head" over such things and just buy their cars and STOP ALL THAT THINKING!! I read that letter to my class in school. My teacher was more offended then I was. Anyway, GM now has a chance to regain my faith with the Volt. This should give the American people pause. This concept is a healthy go between linking today with the hydrogen economy of tomorrow. I am impressed with this effort and with this car. This car should have been here years ago....work starting, at once, after the Arab Oil Embargo in the early 70's.

I applaud GM for this bold stroke. I hope, sincerely, that the flame will not go out and that they will continue to offer real and timely automobiles that are much needed in this new reality.

Thank You.

[Eddie]

GMC sucks. Just take a look at a few of the comments listed above. GMC is going to have to do a lot better than its current slick adversing to lure back these obviously disenchanted consumers.

[Calvin Tininenko]

Sorry for the Zigs 'n Zags in my comments but I need to set the stage a bit...

I travel extensively and rent lots of cars. There are some glitters of light with the Aura and the Malibu, the Buick Lucerne and the LaCrosse. Recently I rented a brand-new Malibu (I-4/4spd auto). The car with comfortable, quiet, and fuel efficient (I put on ~1100 mi in a week and average ~25.4 mpg). Only gripe that I had with the car was its auto trans...the shift-points caused the engine to really bog down. They'd best use a 6-spd auto or one of the new "infinitely variables". The Lucerne is a great auto....but I think it showed up $60/bbl of oil too late! I'll wait to comment on the G8 but...I hope the G8 is better than the G6 on the handling side of things. A styling thing that bothers me with the G series is the front-end treatment that has, like an old horse, just been ridden far to long...way too similar to the not-so Grand Am--IMHO.

I agree with others on this blog that think some of the badges need to go out of business. There are far too many models and options to make economic sense. They need to eliminate badges, models and reduce the darned PARTS LIST! Ever take a look at all the part numbers for one of the stalk-mounted multi-switches for any given model? You don't think having to carry a ga zillion parts rather than a few thousand costs $$$? Think again!

The future of the automotive industry will rest with those that provide 1) RELIABLE cars, 2) Great fuel economy, 4) are fun to drive, and 3) are reasonably stylish.

RELIABLITY
Gone should be the efforts to "just build a car good enough to make it through the 36K mile warranty! Oh you thought that poor reliability wasn't planned? Think again. Buried in the maze of engineers at the "majors", are engineers who try to engineer cars and trucks that are "expendable". GM and the rest of the majors now have to understand that the public is going to be driving their vehicles for longer periods of time due to the endless spiral of escalating prices. For instance, I have a 1999 Toyota 4-Runner with a 3.4L V6/Auto with 207,000+ miles. The vehicle is the most trouble-free vehicle that I've ever owned I change oil regularly at 8,500 mi, use Mobil 1 5w/30....the engine uses NO oil nor does it leak oil. The rest of the maintance has been "as recommended". Oh, yes, I did replace a pinion bearing in the rear axle at 197,000 mi...but other than that NADA! I'll probably drive that 4-Runner another 100K or so...it still looks and drives well, the suspension and steering gear is taut and I get ~24 mpg at 70mph.

Would I rather be driving something from Detroit? Yes, I would...but not if it costs me a bundle in repairs. Come on Detroit...surely you can design more reliable vehicles! Ever drive one of those Chevy Cobalts or the Cavalier? My god, what a sorry excuse for a modern automobile!

FUEL ECONOMY
We don't all need to drive 300+ HP behmoths....unless, of course, it can be made to get 50-60 mpg or more (there are research centers that feel those goals are attainable in the near future. One of those centers have built 1100 cc engines that produce 1250 hp, are multi-fueled, and ~80% thermally efficient! The same center has a 3.0L producing 4500 hp with equally great efficiencies. The idea of running Hummers around LA getting 6-10 mpg is repulsive and unresponsible. A Hummer getting 50 mpg...now that's tolerable!

We could start this migration to higher fuel economy by using turboed I-4s rather than V6s. Turbo-diesel I-4s and V-6s should also be in the works. I recently returned from Europe, while there I used a friend's 2003 VW Jetta TDi. The car was quick, quiet, very reliable (it has nearly 280,000 miles (not KM). On a 2.5 wk trip which included City and Autobahns I averaged slightly under 51 mpg...with generally 3 people in the car and luggage! Here in the U.S. the public is still skittish about diesels because the American manufacturers delivered such lousy product...but the public will forgive and forget IF the manufacturers deliver.

Like it our not, gasoline prices are not going to drop--unless, of course, there is a world-wide recession. The streets of Bangalore, Mumbai, Delhi, Shanghai, and Beijiing are exploding with cars. The American love of the fuelish, bloated SUV is going to wane. It may not at $3.00/gal gas, may not at $4.00/gal but when gas hits $5.00/gal and more (and it will) there's lots of American families that will find a replacement for the family tank. Granted, there are some that will continue to use them, but very few, just to pick up the kids from school!

FUN TO DRIVE
When was the last time an American car was fun to drive? For me, it was my 1968 Dodge RT Convertible 440-6pack....and every option that you could put on that Dodge. The engine was dyno-tuned at 575 HP, got 7 mpg at 25 or 75. The car was fun because it was cool and bad-ass fast. It was made for going in a staight line and fast. Put it on a winding, country road and a Mo-Ped could beat it through the corners! My old BMW 2002 ti now THAT one was fun on those country roads AND at the gas pump! Stylish? Not!...but sure was a blast!

The Aura, the Malibu may be fun with a little tweaking to the suspensions, changing the automatic trans, and putting a turbo on that I-4...better yet how about a 2.0L TDi?

STYLISH
The physics of pushing a vehicle through air seems to limit one to a rather small variety of external design options (we're all familiar with the wind-tunnel derived wedge-shaped vehicles). At times we get lost in a parking lot filled with the ubiquitious wedge designs regardless of their continent of origin. There remains possibilities for design freedom up to a point...but it the auto is fun, economical and reliable...much will be forgiven!

I wish Detroit and GM well. I remain more than a little dismayed by their concerted efforts against the CAFE standards. Reliability is a BIG thing with me...that's the reason that I ride my old VF1100S motorcycles and not a Harley! ( I now own VF1100s #2 & #3 (one with bags one without)... The VF....#1 had 279,000 miles on it before I sent it down the road.) Get the combination right and the world will beat a path to your door...just remember, with all your screw-ups you don't have much time! and by all means...keep listening!

[Fred Nicholson]

GMC NEEDS TO WAKE UP. I have a 01 Yukon with a 5.3 Vortec engine that knocks like a diesel until it warms up. I'm told by GM that this is "NORMAL". If my knocking Vortec engine is considered "NORMAL", are the exact same engines that don't knock considered "ABNORMAL"? If so, it sounds like the consumers that got "ABNORMAL" engines sure got lucky. GMC is simply not standing behind their product if a problem developes that will cost them a lot of money to fix. Period.

[LMK]

I just bought Honda CR-V and it is a reasonably good vehicle to drive. I have had so many bitter experiences with owning a GM-manufactured and Chrystler-manufactured vehicles, that there is no way I will plunk down 20,000 dollars in order to take a chance again on a company that sold me junk in the 1980-s and 1990-s.

[RALPH NETHERS]

I'M CONSIDERING A 2009 CHEVY SIVERADO 1500 THIS SPRING BUT WAS WONDERING IF I COULD GET IT IN A 5.3 V8 ENGINE & A 256 OR 273 REAR END RATIO ? I ALWAYS BUY CHEVYS OR BUICKS AND REMEMBER WHEN I BOUGHT A NEW 1981 1/2 TON NEW WITH 5 SPEED O.D. AND IT HAD A 256 REAR..IT WAS GREAT ON GAS & RAN GREAT (25M.P.G.)
PLEASE OFFER SOMETHING LIKE THIS SOON, AS IT SEEMS LIKE THESE NEW CHEVYS ARE GEARED TOO LOW FOR ME, IT'S ALL ABOUT GAS MILAGE
TODAY!
THANKS

[cal]

Lets see how the unions treat the employees now that they own most of the company. I bet the union mgt changes thier take on giving raises and benefis. They will take big checks and not worry about the workers.
So they drove the company into BK, why should they not run it?!
Look our American Auto industry, you'll go the way of the US steel industry - becasue of the unions.
Thanks for all the innovation over the years - the cupholder.